INT: Locations and building on GREASE. What needed to be built? What did you want? Now I realize you prefer to be on stage. [RK: Yeah.] But you were in high school stuff. [RK: Yeah.] So what was the balance?

RK: We had three high schools that we used for various parts of the show. But one example of building a set was when we began shooting we knew that Olivia [Olivia Newton-John] was gonna have a solo, but we didn't know what it would be. It had not been written. And so while we were shooting, John Farrar wrote the song, “Hopelessly Devoted to You”. And brought it to the trailer and played it. I had never heard a demo before, so I didn't, you know, I had heard him singing, "Hopelessly devoted...," and I went, you know? I said, "Well it sounds a little country-western, I don't know," and Olivia said, "Well, I like it." And I said, "Oh, I guess okay,” back off. 'Cause I didn't know how it was gonna turn out. And then we had to figure out where to shoot it or where to stick it in the script because it wasn't in the script. And so we looked and said, "Well, we could put it between these two things, after the Sandra Dee number and before the boys, Stockard [Stockard Channing] leaves or I don't know where it was, but anyhow we figured a spot for it. And then we said, "Okay, let's do it in the backyard of Frenchie's house, so we'll have to have a set for that." And literally said, "We need a backyard set," and the next day it was built on Paramount. I mean it was so fast, Production Designer Phil Jefferies [Philip M. Jefferies] said, "Well what do you want?" I said, "Well just the backyard with a trellis and put a little swimming pool there, 'cause I want to do something where she looks in and sees Travolta [John Travolta] in the pool." [INT: Where did the idea of the pool come in? And just as you think about your own process.] Yeah. [INT: Because here, that's a very significant moment in the movie.] Well, I heard the song and I wanted to, she's singing “Hopelessly Devoted to You”, and I wanted to show who she was hopelessly devoted to. And how do you do that? And I just thought, "Well, a reflection in a pool." So I asked him to put a little kiddie pool in the back. And then we shot that all in one shot, pretty much. The whole scene was done in one shot, because it was the last day of shooting, I believe. And you know, it was a simple walk, she just sang the song and sat down, it was all done in one piece. So that was another one that's sort of thrown together at the last minute. And it's funny because the two songs that were the most thrown together are the ones people remember most. Strange. [INT: Very, but that also has to do and maybe...] Well Olivia's performance is so good, you know, she's... [INT: Yeah, she's wonderful in that moment.] Yeah, yeah. [INT: And it's interesting that... I mean, it's just like the Frank Sinatra idea, she actually sings the meaning of the song, not just you know, her voice.] Right. [INT: You know, she was obviously there.]

INT: What made you conceive of her [Olivia Newton-John] moving [during the “Hopelessly Devoted to You” scene in GREASE]? I mean, you could've just done a MARCUS WELBY [MARCUS WELBY, M.D.], we’ll just have her sit on the steps and sing that song.

RK: Well, Pat Birch [Patricia Birch] was my partner in GREASE and she was the one responsible for all the musical numbers and the movements and she said, "Well, what do we have her do? Climb the fence?" You know, ‘cause we had this little set and there's nothing to do, so Pat came up with the idea of her... the route that she went on. And pretty much, you know, that was how she choreographed that.

INT: Why three schools? Why not just one?

RK: The opening at Venice High School just has a great look, as you live in Venice, so you know that high school, it's just wonderful. And a couple of the... while we were there we shot the bleachers; we shot Stockard's [Stockard Channing] number; we shot some of the interiors. But I think some of the interiors we needed... no, I think... I know what it was. The gymnasium wasn't quite right, so we found one in East Hollywood for the gymnasium, and then we found other parts of that school that would work for other scenes, but that was the main point was that gymnasium. And the carnival scene was the other key set, and then we would work... we just shot the carnival scene at John Marshall High School. [INT: And the carnival that came in, did you go to carnivals?] No. I think Phil Jefferies [Philip M. Jeffries] just ordered a carnival, and they showed up with all their things and set it up the way they wanted to, we didn't even... I had nothing to do with how it was set up. They just flopped all the rides down and we shot. [INT: But that opening with that takes you sort of past and around the Ferris wheel.] Oh yeah. [INT: So then you just on set?] Yeah, it was just there. Yeah, we just said, "Well why don't we do that?" you know. [INT: But had you ordered... 'cause this is interesting, as you said your responsibility as keeping on budget means, "The equipment I'm gonna order is gonna be used or I'm not gonna need it."] Right. [INT: Did you know not having even seen this that, "Today I definitely need a crane."] No, but Bill Butler, the Cinematographer did. The whole thing about that carnival was that it was not written that way, we were supposed to go to a theme park. And they couldn't afford to go to a theme park, so we said, "What's the second best thing? Bring the theme park to the school." So that's how that came about. I mean it was downgrading the script from... 'cause they were all gonna go in buses, and we were gonna have a musical number on the bus going to the theme park, and going on rides in the theme park. And they said, "We can't afford that." So… carnival. [INT: So this is fabulous in terms of your capacity as a leader to be able to adjust to realities that are thrown at you.] Well another example in GREASE was the race; I wanted to have it at a football, you know, the track, the school track. It had them driving around the track and have floats in the middle that were gonna be like the Ben-Hur floats. That's why we called them the gladiators, 'cause it was supposed to have those big reproductions of the Ben-Hur things. But the studio said, "We can't afford to build the floats, so go shoot it in the LA River [Los Angeles River]." And so I said, "Okay." And we went there and it was much better in the LA River than if I had done it the way I wanted to. [INT: So here you're walking to the LA River, are you in the middle of actually making the movie?] Yes. [INT: And you're making now… when are you scouting the LA River?] I don't remember scouting the LA River; I think someone pre-scouted it and we just showed up there, as I recall. I don't remember going there.

INT: Now there's some wonderful images in that [race] sequence [in GREASE], for example her [Olivia Newton-John] and Frenchie where they sit. You know, on the side. I mean they're just... [RK: Right.] I mean it works so well. As you sort of step back and look, "Okay, I'm walking onto a set." You did this twice on GREASE now; you did that in the carnival. [RK: Yeah.] And you're doing it here. Have you storyboarded some of this even without knowing where you're gonna be?

RK: I remember storyboarding all that the day that we went there. I just looked around and saw where everything was and started drawing them because we said, "Look, put the bad guys here and the good guys there," you know. It was kinda done that day and I remember the shot of Cha-Cha DiGregorio in the front and the guys in the back with a split diopter, I remember drawing that and saying, "Can we do this?" And that's... [INT: How did you know about a split diopter?] I guess from film school. [INT: See? There's value in a film school.] Yeah, yeah.

INT: Your capacity to respond to something unpredictable. You know, I do ask this question every now and then to other Directors, how does the accident, not obviously a physical accident, but the accident play in the process of moviemaking, and you're giving us repeated examples of where, "This is not what we planned or expected."

RK: Right. Yeah. No, it's great. I think some of the best things happen because of mistakes or accidents, improvs. It keeps it fresh and trying to land on our feet whenever something hits you, you have to. You have to, or you don't survive. [INT: Did you learn that from your folks as well?] Maybe. I think I learned a lot about dealing with people when I worked at my father's camp for emotionally disturbed children, where I had varying degrees of schizophrenia and other problems. And I was trying to teach them how to make lanyards. And how to focus the whole group onto one subject. [INT: And what were some of the things that worked when you were trying to do this?] Just grabbing attention somehow, figuring out what each person needed to get their attention focused, and then try to pull it all together. [INT: And as you think about that, it was a long time ago, but as you think about what someone might need, what would you recognize particularly in these kids that were, you know, disturbed?] Yeah. Well some of them needed jokes, some of them needed to get your eye contact, you know, or something that would attract their attention, so each person was different. You have to analyze what each person needs and try to find a way to focus them. [INT: It's interesting about focus.] Yeah.

INT: I want to go to locations still. BLUE LAGOON. Did anyone suggest, "Well, why don't we just shoot this in Malibu?"

RK: No. No, because this is my project and I was the leading force on that one. And I knew I had to make it low budget, and so one of my classmates at USC was Richard Franklin, who was an Australian, and he had done very low budget movies in Australia. So I figured if we shot in the South Pacific I could get an Australian Crew, and the first thing I said to each Crewmember was, "Have you ever gone camping?" And if they said, "Yes," then they got the part. Because there was no room service on BLUE LAGOON, it was all living in tents. So, and trying to find the right island was a big deal. [INT: How'd you make your decision?] Well we went all over Queensland, we went to Hawaii, looked around Hawaii. I just wanted to have this perfect kind of beach and this certain look. And I wasn't finding it. And then I realized that a movie had been made before, 1949, I believe. THE BLUE LAGOON was shot part of it in Fiji and a lot of it in the stages in England with Jean Simmons. And so I tried to track down where that movie was filmed. And I found the movie by flying in a seaplane over the Fijian Islands and looking for the little island off of a cove. You know, 'cause there was a scene in the original 1946 movie where they pull up to this cove and there was a little tiny island in the back. So by flying over all these islands, I found this cove with a little island and landed the seaplane and went on to the beach, and found that spot. So we went back and shot there. [INT: As you were wandering around this island, sometimes a location will talk to you and say, "Why don't you shoot here?" Because you didn't even know it, you walk in and then suddenly it's there. Because there's a number of spaces that you needed in THE BLUE LAGOON, where are you gonna build where they end up living for a while. Where the other people on the other side of the island are living. Which were the challenges? How did you decide?] Pretty much that one cove was so perfect and then the island itself was owned by an American, and so making the deal with him, and he had lots of little coves all over the island and today they've turned it into a big tourist destination, very high, very expensive tourist destination for honeymooners and stuff. But then it was just very raw, there was nothing there, there was no roads, no electricity; it was like a total island with nothing except beautiful coves and this guy living there. And so we were able to make an easy deal with him, to use his whole island and build on the island a little encampment for our Crew. And so it was one-stop shopping, you know? We found this, we just made the deal with the guy; we built the tent city and moved in. [INT: In the design of the home that they construct, what occurred for you in terms of how that got built?] Well it had to be made out of local materials, and the Production Designer, Jon Dowding came up with a little model that he constructed, which I have in my office now, and it was just so cool. And it was built exactly to those specifications in the cove. And it was just magical to see this little model become this full-scale set, all made out of natural materials. [INT: In building the statue or the god stone thing. How did that... 'cause that's not there on this island, you guys...] It wasn't there, no. It was done in Australia with polyethylene pieces and then they shipped all the pieces and we put it together on the island. [INT: And it's a specific design, how did that emerge? Do you remember?] Out of sketches, I think I did a sketch of the god and gave it to the production people and they did it in Australia and then shipped it over and put it together there. [INT: Got it. So this is an image of yours?] Yeah. [INT: Got it. I like it too because it's more suggestive than being specific.] Right, right. [INT: Do you remember...] I wanted it to look like it had been worn down over the years, like it had been maybe, you know, one of those Easter Island things that, you know, had been worn away by years and years of...

INT: Okay, let's jump to another location. Why didn't you shoot SUMMER LOVERS in Malibu? Why did you want to go to Santorini, one of the most beautiful spaces in the Mediterranean?

RK: Have you been there? [INT: Yes, I have.] Oh my god, yes. Well when I was doing publicity for THE BLUE LAGOON, I was doing the circuit with all the journalists that come and sit and talk to you. One of them was... I was just chatting with him and I said, "Where have you been?" And he said, "I went to Santorini." I said, "What's that?" And he told me, started telling me about this place where all these kids from around the world come and they backpack and they're all swimming in this beautiful locations. And I thought, "Well, I want to take a vacation myself," so I decided to go there and see what he was talking about. And I went and I looked around and I said, "Wow, what a great spot for a movie." And so I started coming up with some ideas and I started writing it. It was all because of this vacation that the journalist suggested. [INT: There's so much sort of in that movie, what I'd call documentary of the space. So again, this is somewhat about locations, it's also I guess maybe about the shooting yourself, but knowing how you're going to... what parts you're gonna photograph, 'cause you're all over that island. And you know, you choose a specific house that I assume you didn't build, I don't know if you did the interior.] No, that was finding the perfect spot with one house over here, a cove and the other house there. So we could see each other and then, yeah. That was just discovering that and going, "Wow, this fits into the story perfectly." [INT: And all of the stuff on the beach, particularly in the opening stuff with the arrivals of the planes and the boats and all the kids there, was that part of your location research? Or was that...] Yeah, because that's the way it was. I mean I went there that summer after I learned about it and then the next year we went back and shot, so I knew what to expect and I knew I had a lot of second unit guys shooting what I needed. And yeah, a lot of that was done without me, you know, I just said, "This is the kind of shots I want," and sent them out.

INT: Again sticking on locations and design. The design of NAVIGATOR [FLIGHT OF THE NAVIGATOR], you've got a science complex lab. [RK: NASA. Yeah.] And you've got obviously the spaceship itself. Talk about your process in making choices here.

RK: Well the lab, we were gonna shoot at Cape Canaveral, and what happened was the Challenger disaster happened. And so they shut down all that. So we had to find something that looked like NASA and put NASA signs on it. I don't remember what it was, some kind of a industrial complex or something. That was how we did that. And for the spaceship, I was going around to different effects houses, just meeting people and in one of them there's a kid sitting in the lobby with a book. And I said, "Hi, what's your name?" And he said, "I'm Ed Eyth [Edward Eyth], and I've just graduated from CalArts and I'm here for an interview." I said, "Can I see your book?" And he opens it up and there's all this kind of real super high-tech futuristic cars and things like that, so I said, "Do you want to come try out for FLIGHT OF THE NAVIGATOR?" And he ended up doing all of the designs for the ship; it was just by chance. It was his first job, and he gave me so many choices, because he was eager, he was just out of college. And as a matter of fact he just, I ran in... he's just sent me all the old drawings the other day. He said, "I found these and I scanned them and thought you might...," and just many, many, many different versions of that. [INT: And the interior—it’s interesting. The interior and exterior of that ship, and because he's going to quote, be the navigator, what was your process in making decisions about... again, 'cause he could've had a wheel, he could've had a, you know, stick, and you've got...] That was pretty much Ed's designs, you know? He was very imaginative, came up with all these ideas. And the idea of the ship changing shape came from my brother Jeff [Jeffrey Kleiser] who is a Visual Effects Supervisor and he was doing commercials at the time. And I saw one of the commercials he did where a Tide bottle changed shape, you know? It was the first time morphing had happened, so I said, "Can we use that to change the shape of the ship when it goes fast?" And then the other thing that I saw was a book called “Special Effects” and it talked about the future. The last page of the book had a picture of a chrome dog, where they had taken a CGI, a CGI... what do you call it? Lines, the... [INT: The structure.] Structure, yeah. A CGI structure and wrapped the photographic background onto it, to make it look reflective. So that was talking about some day you'll be able to do this. And so I talked to my brother and said, "Can we combine the Tide bottle and this thing that they're saying is gonna come reflectance mapping," and that's how that came about. And later James Cameron used that in TERMINATOR, for the guy. [INT: Did he come and check with you to see how you did it?] I'm sure he saw it, I'm sure he did. [INT: In choosing for example the resort in...] LOVEWRECKED? [INT: Yeah, LOVEWRECKED…] That was basically the Producer had a friend who had a resort, and said, "Hey you can stay here for free if you promote the resort," so that's how that came about. [INT: Did you build anything for that one or was that...?] I don't think so; I think that was all location in that resort, yeah. [INT: Got it.]

INT: In terms of as you're scouting a location, particularly in BLUE LAGOON or something like that, or the Santorini thing, how does that affect your use of camera? What are you doing? Are you, 'cause I know you're a bit of a technologically oriented wizard. Have you gone through stages where you’ll, first you were shooting with still cameras and then the little video cameras? Or how do you use that in, sort of both use of location and preparation for shooting?

RK: Yeah. I think video shoots, yeah. I did a lot of that for scouting locations. And also for just experimenting with different visuals that are gonna be used in a movie. I mean, for FLIGHT OF THE NAVIGATOR, before we discovered reflectance mapping, I was in my backyard with silver paint, pouring, try to show it melting and I had a paper plate with mirrored surface and I was going around with a video camera trying to shoot like that before we discovered the other thing. So a lot of video experimentation. And for scouting, trying angles and things like that.

INT: I was thinking just again about how a location determining how you're going to shoot something. There's a sequence in THE BLUE LAGOON I guess, I don't know what that's called, when the... [RK: Phosphorescence?] Yes. How did that happen?

RK: I wanted to capture that and it was impossible in those--[INT: How did you even know about it?] Well 'cause I'd been to Fiji and seen it, you know? When you swim in that, your hand goes through and the plankton lights up as you move your hand through. And so I want to see how... it was impossible to shoot. Today, probably you could get it because those cameras are so sensitive. But, I talked to my brother Jeff [Jeffrey Kleiser] about how to do it, and he came up with a solution in the optical printer, where you took like the swimmers and you printed each frame a couple times with different layers of intensity, so it would get less. So when they move through the first frame was bright and then the second, third, through fourth would be less, so that it would look like they were having a stream of phosphorescent. And James Cameron told me that he saw that and it inspired him for, in AVATAR when they were walking through the forest and you know? [INT: Wow. But again this is a location in a sense, I mean you didn't know about that until you experienced it. I mean 'cause I think I vaguely had heard of it and I think I from this movie.] Maybe it was in the book. I think it was in the book. I think it was. Yes, it was in the book. And I guess I hadn't experienced it 'til I got to Fiji, but when we're there I experienced it and then trying to figure out how to do it later was with Jeff. [INT: Got it.]

INT: First day on the set. What do you do?

RK: I try to make the Crew feel like they're on an adventure that's gonna be fun. [INT: And how do you do that?] Well, I try to get my Assistant to take pictures of everybody and write their name under it and give it to me in a printout so I can start to know their names because a lot of times you don't on the first day. And if you can... Nina [Nina Foch] always said that was so important to call the Crewmembers by their names, 'cause you'll get them to snap to and really help you. Sometimes I will say some kind of an announcement about the movie and try to get everyone on board from a morale standpoint. One of the people that I really, really wish I could be more like was Garry Marshall, 'cause he was able to do jokes on the set every day, and man, I wish I could do that. But I don't have that talent. But I did notice, I think I saw some behind the scenes video of him and how he handled the set and how he got the Crew together by always joking with them and that's such a great talent to have. [INT: So would it be, you would gather the Crew together on first day and...] Well, just talk about the movie and thank them for being there, and say, "We're gonna make a great movie," that type of thing, just to get some morale going. [INT: Got it.]

INT: When you arrive on a set, this is on any set, what will be... when will you arrive and what will be the first things you do? Not on the first day of shooting, but one of the first things you'll do?

RK: I like to get there early and I just suss out where everything's gonna be and make sure that my first setup is really clear and that everybody knows what they're doing. A trick I learned from working with Studios was to shoot an insert first. 'Cause they look on there, "When did the first shot get off? Oh, it was an eight o'clock call, 8:10 for a shot? Great," and they'd leave you alone for a while. So always shoot something simple first and then that gets them off your back. But aside from that always trying to make sure that that first setup is very, very clear and ready to go. So that there's not this hour of everyone sort of having coffee and wandering around and saying, "Hi, what's going on?" Because a lot of times the day can be a real drag if you don't get everybody focused at the beginning. [INT: And will you just speak to your AD about the plan for the day? And will you do that before that day or will you do that on the day? And how will you do it?] Well, I usually show up in the morning with the storyboards and say, "This is what we're shooting today." And then we go over any problems or any changes in the order or any difficulties we might be having with weather or something that's just come up like they won't let us shoot there or something like that.

INT: Let's talk about camera. And specifically about what you look for in a Cameraperson [Director of Photography]?

RK: I like to work with Cameramen who operate because then you know that their eye is what you're getting; you know their sense of composition and how they will move with an Actor if he starts doing something different. It's just more of a filmmaker, you know? A DP who operates feels more like a filmmaker to me. [INT: And what will be your discussion with your Cameraperson before you're shooting?] Well, my go-to guy was of course Néstor Almendros, who was this wonderful artist and in every movie that he did, he would base it on a painter, a painter's work. He wrote a book called A MAN AND A CAMERA [A MAN WITH A CAMERA] where each chapter he talks about which painter he was emulating and in the case of BLUE LAGOON it was Paul Gauguin, and we looked at a lot of Gauguin's work and we looked a lot of South Sea movies. HURRICANE, John Ford's HURRICANE. And we copied a lot of the shots from that or we were inspired by all the shots from that. And yeah, watch movies that are like the type that you want to do or photographs, that's a good way to communicate. [INT: In GREASE where you're now doing a musical, you for the first time, were you and your Cameraperson watching musicals that had been made before?] No. That was so fast, I mean even though we had five weeks rehearsal and he was there, we were kind of... I was overwhelmed by, you know, trying to make this Broadway musical come to life and mostly working with fixing the script and dealing with Pat Birch [Patricia Birch] and how we were going to go in and out of the musical numbers. And I never really spoke to Bill Butler about the look of the film. We just showed up and started shooting. And I guess Bill had an idea of having it be kind of this heightened Technicolor look and that was fine with me. I mean I didn't have a chance to talk about it. [INT: Were you the person that hired Bill in this particular case?] No, Bill was hired by Allan Carr before me. He was the first guy hired. Unusual. [INT: Yeah, truly. But he's a good guy, so you were in good hands without a question. And a talented man, clearly.

INT: In terms of the other looks for example in the look that you wanted for SUMMER LOVERS, what was your relationship with the Cameraperson [Director of Photography] on that? And I realize that you obviously, you said you had additional camera work done by other people.

RK: Yeah. Well, I hired a guy who was Greek and spoke Greek. And pretty much that was the main reason that I hired him. On the shoot he had some... I don't know what kind of difficulties he was having, but he was operating, and maybe it was that he wasn't used to operating, I don't know, but there were some major operating problems and I had to fire him. And... [INT: How long into the show?] About two weeks. [INT: Did you have to redo?] Yes. Some of it we had to... not all of it, but some of it. And I hired a Greek Cameraman who was a second-unit guy to take over. And when it came down to the credits, they wanted to give full credit to the guy who shot for two weeks. And I said, "Well, you know, we had to let him go and you know, I have a video that shows the problems we had." And the IA refused to listen to that, so we had a Greek Director of Photography as the Second [2nd Assistant Director], and he got the Second. [INT: How did you tell the first guy?] He knew 'cause we would show the... we would project the dailies and we'd go, you know, like that. You know? There were so many things where the camera would go off here or go off there, after the Actor. And you know, I think it was because I had just worked with Néstor Almendros and I said, "I want a Camera Operator, a guy who operates," and maybe he hadn't done that, maybe he had just been... maybe he had worked with an Operator because he wanted to please me, he decided he'd try it and it didn't work.

INT: There's a real style, there's a camera style to that movie [SUMMER LOVERS] that differs from other of your films. Or at least feels to me different. There are similarities to BLUE LAGOON in some sense, but you know, you're choosing a space where you've got a very wide shot giving us something and then shifting into, you know, a closer space and so there's a knowledge of distance and proximity in terms of the way you're staging certain scenes. And I'm not talking about camera movements, I'm not literally saying, you know, "Here I'm showing you this," and there's a certain beauty within the frame, and then you know, I'll move in to where this particular story is. What's happening there?

RK: Well the island of Santorini. I mean it's just so staggeringly beautiful. And the white buildings and the dark ocean behind it and the sky and it's just so... you can't shoot any bad shots there. And I wanted to capture the feeling of being there and it holds up when you have a wide shot there, you want to look at it for a while, you don't want to jump in right away, you know? [INT: Got it.]

INT: I want to look at just on locations [used for SUMMER LOVERS], the choice of the archeological site, was there something going on there at that time?

RK: The archeological site that's in Santorini was supposedly the Lost Continent of Atlantis, that's what they say. They think it was. And they were digging up this whole city and that was like almost 40 years ago. I wonder if it's all dug up by now. I don't know. I haven't been back. [INT: But you knew from your first summer that that was happening, that was...] No, no. When I location scouted I heard about this, it's a tourist attraction, Akrotiri it's called. And like I say it may have been all dug up by now, but... [INT: Did you then, it's interesting here, then from hearing about this location, did you then decide, "Okay, I want to have Lina work there."] Yeah. That's right. [INT: In your script was Lina working somewhere else? Or was it even part of the story?] It wasn't part of the story. I just, when I heard about Akrotiri I thought, "Okay, she's kind of a sophisticated European girl, and why not make her an archeologist?" It added to the character. [INT: It definitely did. I mean, you know... ] And got to use the location. [INT: Both.]

INT: What do you do with your Actors? Let's say you have a scene now--just in terms of one thing. I know that in location just for one more second, IT’S MY PARTY I assume, 'cause I think some of it was your house, what about the other house which is so significant in that movie?

RK: That was completely built because it was very important to me that it be in real time, and you felt the sun going down. And you couldn't do that on location. So Clark Hunter was the Designer [Production Designer] and we had an exterior for just walking in and out at the front, but the whole interior and the backyard was all done on a, not a stage, it was a warehouse. But I wanted clearly in the script the sun to be going, you know, at different angles for each shot, so that we felt like it was actually going down in real time. [INT: And in terms of talking to your Cameraperson [Director of Photography] about the light in that movie, what was your discussion?] Just that you wanted to feel the sun dropping and going into dusk and going into night. And it had to be very specific so that it felt like you were actually there and it was happening. [INT: Did you initially consider the possibility of a real location and making that work?] I did, and I'm glad I didn't do it because the day that we were shooting one of those scenes with the sun, where they're actually talking about the sun going down, there was pounding rain on the top of the warehouse. So it would not have worked. [INT: A decision that nature was agreeing with you in this particular moment.] Yeah, yeah, it was really helpful because it wouldn't have worked at all if we had tried to do it on location, that part.

INT: What do you do when… You're walking on a set, you're early here, you're figuring out where you're gonna shoot. And you have one scene, let's say, or two scenes to do. What will you do with your Actors? [RK: When you have one scene to do?] I mean, I guess what I'm asking is, is there ever--how do you rehearse with them for the day's work? How will you proceed?

RK: Well, it's always nice to let them do whatever they want to start with, to see if they have some instinct that will add to it. And then shape it if... I mean I'll have an idea of what I want, and then see what they do. And then try to amalgamate them into one thing that works. [INT: So will you have a... will you bring your Actors out and have them rehearse in front of the Crew? And again I'm sort of being very specific in terms of methodology.] Yeah. It's always nice to have the Actors alone, I find, at the beginning of every scene with nobody around. Maybe the Cameraman [Director of Photography] and the AD [Assistant Director], just hovering in the background but not like right up in front, so that the Actors feel free to move around and try things. And sometimes it's too early to bring in the Cameraman 'cause they'll start doing all this kind of stuff and then the Actors are, you know, trying to play to the camera and stuff, so that doesn't work. So it's better to have nobody around at the beginning and then slowly bring them in. [INT: In the...] You've been there.

INT: When you're working with more challenging Actors, like Klaus [Klaus Maria Brandauer] I'm gonna use. I assume he was challenging because he has a history of being challenging. How do you handle it?

RK: By just being zen, you know. With him, like I can remember an example. There was a moment when at the end of a scene, I said, "I'd like you to give Ethan," Ethan Hawke, "a feeling of warmth in your eye, I want to see some warmth 'cause you know, at the end of the scene you're sort of agreeing with whatever he was doing." And he says, "I did it." I said, "Well, I didn't see it." And he said, "Well, you'll see it in dailies." I said, "No Klaus, I want to see it now." "Oh you mean you want me to do this?" And he did a real exaggerated look. I said, "Yes, exactly like that." And then we rolled the camera and he did it the right way. You know, but he had to push buttons and pull and to do all that to just needle, you know? [INT: That's a great example, though, because you kept it moving rather than saying... you know, here's an interesting question. Do you say no to an Actor? Or when you want to say no to the Actor, like this example...] I try to coerce. Not say no, because then if you say no they'll dig their heels in and you won't get what you want, I don't think. To sort of guide them more than instruct them I think is the way to go, 'cause it has to come from them or it's not gonna work.